Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

Call of Duty Black Ops II Xbox 360

Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

I feel like hardcore, with its quicker time to kill, actually exaggerates all the problems of core. One stray or lucky bullet will put an end to you. In core, a higher time to kill means you have more time to evade, go prone, get off a nade, fire back etc. Having to land 4-5 bullets on a target requires more accuracy and consistency of skill than just getting off that first one.


It's also interesting that HC rewards the two extremes of gameplay, (camping and rushing) but not anything in between.  If you're rushing a corner, that ~300ms inherent latency gives you the upper hand.  If you're camping, you can hold down and area, hide in corners, and remain out of sight without anyone ever seeing a killcam. 
In this way it has more tactical realism, but we all know CoD hasn't been remotely realistic in a few years.

Granted, I know that it's so dependent on your ping, the host, other players, and which way the wind is blowing that everyone will have a different experience.


And don't get me wrong, I was always a hardcore only player up until MW3. I just think that with the net code/lag comp/whatever being the way it is, Core is the only way I stand a chance, unless I resort to camping.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to Recluse1

I'm a hybrid of both camping and rushing. It really depends on the flow of the game. I'll rush but if I'm getting destroyed I'll lockdown an area, get a few kills and move on. I think that no matter what mode you play you will do better by adjusting your style. I don't experience extreme camping in this game, occasionally it happens but it's all about flushing them out. It's also a fun challenge to flank a team that is holding down an area. I respect all styles and it is essential to learn them all to be ready for anything that comes your way.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

nicedrewishfela wrote:

First off.. This is NOT a Hardcore vs Core discussion. I am a Hardcore Player, and I have respect for those who enjoy Core as well. Please leave that discussion at the door, it will be Off Topic here.

What I am asking is if HC players are seeing connections in this game differently than core players.

As a Hardcore Player, I have had minimal problem with "Lag Compensation" and "Hit Detection". My bullets go where I aim them, and They hit where I aim. I still get some WTF moments, but 9/10 times when I take a second look I find my aim was off or the other player just had the drop on me. I still get laggy lobbies. I still get incidents where I get "Connection Interrupted", but for the most part the game plays like it should play.

I read the complaints on here, and maybe it is just me, but it seems the Lag Comp/Hit Detection discussions are usually started by Core Players. The threads talk about bullets going through the opponent or enemies appearing to be bullet sponges.

So my question is pretty straight forward. Is it just that the elements of Core (Health Regen, 100% health, etc) make the lag more evident? Is there more to it than that? Is it the larger community?

Would love to get some answers for how your experience has been with the following info in there somewhere-

1) Do you play Core or Hardcore?

2) What has your Gameplay experience (connection only mind you, not asking about OP guns, etc) been like?

3) Have you played both and noticed a difference connection wise?

Thanks, and looking forward to hearing your responses. No right or wrong answers here... just want to hear your experiences. Politely asking for no flame wars or expletive laced tirades. Be Awesome to Eachother.

I played a lot of Core KC until they finally added HC KC.

When I played Core KC, I wasn't all that concerned about my KDR so it was a touch low. What I found was a lot of red dot watching. Once I started overfiring (compared to what you do in HC), doing a lot of hip firing, running Ghost with a suppressed MP7, I started to run through people. Core players just tend to over rely on the always on help (mini map, reticle, etc.) versus tactical awareness because there is a lot more forgiveness built into it.

I noticed that I would win a lot more gun fights in core when either the opponoent shot first or my first few shots didn't register. In HC, I would have been dead. You simply have time to react in Core that does not exist in HC. Add in the health fairy, and I would be back to normal in no time. Grenades are far less effective. And the amount of intel you can gleen from a kill cam is a bit much.

KC pace is similar in each but I truly find HC KC has a faster pace for the most part. The game length may take longer but there are more kills and deaths being registered. Why? Tags that I might be able to get in the open in Core would result in my death in HC.

Most important thing I noticed... time to kill in BO2 has come way down from previous titles making it playable to me. However, it's still driven by two main things... ROF and DPS. If Core players took an HC mindest for movement andtactics they might enjoy it more and complain less about OP weapons. Thjose weapons seem OP to the Core player because of their ROF, DPS, or both.

But when you hit the bad side of lag on HC? Fugeedaboutit.

That's my opinion but it should be yours ;-),
RAN
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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

i am a predominantly hardcore player. here is my take:

i get hit detection, sudden appearance of player model, delayed camera, and skipping.

i get these MORE when i player core modes. they are far more noticible. in hardcore, i still get them, but the frustrating moments are less frequent and not as severe in thier appearance. my only correlation is that there are more lobbies in core with bad connections that allow a higher number of these events to occur.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

nicedrewishfela wrote:

So my question is pretty straight forward. Is it just that the elements of Core (Health Regen, 100% health, etc) make the lag more evident? Is there more to it than that? Is it the larger community?

Would love to get some answers for how your experience has been with the following info in there somewhere-

1) Do you play Core or Hardcore?

2) What has your Gameplay experience (connection only mind you, not asking about OP guns, etc) been like?

3) Have you played both and noticed a difference connection wise?

1) I play both but 85% of my games have been HC

2) In HC I have issues with one or two people in 1 out of 20-30 games.  They are usually on a one bar connection and will show all the normal signs (bad hit detection, they are a 1-2 seconds ahead of me, etc).  I will say my games last night were very bad.  Two or three lobbies where everyone on the other team was one bar.  Made the game near unplayable.  Not sure if this is because of the new maps or the update for the new maps but it was not a fun experience last night.  

I find Core to be too inconsistent.  I tend to use the SCAR or AN 94 in Core and I will get kills on some people in 3 or 4 shots and some in 6 or 8 shots when aiming in a similar area of the body.  So I will stop shooting after 4 shots and move on to the next person only to find out I died because person 1 really required 1 or 2 more bullets.

3) It is not that HC solves the connection problems I just think it is easier to play around. It is also eaiser to justify your deaths in HC given your low amount of health.  For instance, if you die in one or two shots that is to be expected.  Every battle is quick.  You shoot they shoot if you have the jump on them you should win.  HC seems to play out this way. 

There are still times when I need to shoot more times than I should but even than I usually get the kill.  In core the killcam makes the issue 1000 times worse.  You know what you saw on your screen and when you watch the killcam your bullets are 3 or 4 feet in the wrong direction. 

Similar to this is the one bullet kills.  You are shooting have 4-5 shots into them and they turn around and then you die instantly.  Call it lag or lag comp I don't care in core I don't expect to die in 1 shot.  If it happened in HC, you can't watch a killcam and you expect to die quickly so you take the death and move on. 

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

Im a regular hardcore player. But I do go to core when playing with friends.

I play hardcore because I like it when I shoot things they have the decency to fall over and die. This drives most of my experience when plaing HC. Experience wise Ive gotten good as feeling out what lobbies are working to my advantage and this is exactly why I feel the game is 60% connection and 40% skill. I can get into lobbies where I am dominating gameplay and then bang "host migration" and all of a sudden the game ends and Im a negative KDR.

My litmus test is the higher ROF weapons. If im running around with a Scorpion with rapid fire and the enemy crosses my stream of bullets at close range without a hitmarker thats when its time to leave. Another sign Im behind the curve is when thrown grenades or fired rockets disappear before exploding. The only explanation for this is according to the host: the enemy saw, shot, and killed me before  I pulled the trigger on the launcher eventhough I saw the rocket fire.

I really dont notice a difference connection wise. I get as many bad core connections as I get hardcore. The only difference is how the latency manifests itself .

Like I said above, this game is more about connection then skill. Sorry if that rains on the parades of those folks who fell they are super elite COD players. Unless your playing on a LAN your great games are most likely the product of you having the latency advantage. Not saying there arent some great players Im just saying that public games is not where you can get an accurate measure.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

After switching to Hardcore a few weeks ago I've found this game less frustrating.

It certainly seems that I have less problems with "lag compensation" as people like to call it.

Don't get me wrong,I still have a few issues. I still get insta deaths(I know you die straight away in HC but some I still get instances where I just drop dead without appearing to have received any damage).

I think part of the problem with Core is the mini map as well. I know that i'd spend too much time watching that than the actual screen. So if you have a UAV up you'd be watching the mini map and waiting for people,but if you were slightly behind them then they'd kill you first. Whereas in HC you have to be more cautious and actually LOOK OUT for players.

Now that I play HC there's no way I could switch back to Core. I know that coz I tried to to play the new maps and got annoyed very quickly.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

up until about a month ago, i only played core. everytime i faced someone, there'd be a hiccup while firing, i'd lag for a millisecond, and lose the fight.

i needed to start ranking up sniper rifles, so i went to hardcore. it is, without a doubt, a totally different game. there is virtually no connection issues for me, but there does seem to be more host migrations. i have tried to go back to core to play the other game modes, but i can't do it. every time i do, i end up throwing the controller at the wall. now i just want more game modes in hc.

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Re: Hardcore Gameplay Experience Vs Core Gameplay Experience

in reply to NiceDrewishFela

Me and nicewish already discussed this in another thread prior to this being posted, where I stated that I've become a full time HC player on BO2. Not just me, but nearly everyone in my clan (19 members), and the non clan friends we play with as well.

I tried to play core the other day and I just can't do it anymore, I'm not exactly and MLG player but I run a 1.53 K/D and decent SPM, my map knowedge and tactics are good and I know I can get the drop on people. In HC, this pays dividends for me, in core, I just get hitmarkers before they spin round or halo jump and kill me with the same gun I'm using.

It's the same for everyone I play with, even the people who didn't like the idea of HC at first have got used to it and once they go back and try core again they can't believe how much people sponge and come straight back.

All we need now is more game modes....

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