Weapon balance feedback V2

Black Ops II Xbox 360

All of this has been discussed endlessly, so I'm just going to type down the conclusions:



Add more sway (high amount, medium-low speed) to deter long range usage.

Peacekeeper: Should just be 625 RPM 3-4-5 hit kill.

Remember that the USMC and PDW57 already kills in 3 hits on short range, firing at 725 RPM -- the same rate of fire as the current Peacekeeper, except they need one less hit to kill.

PDW is only BARELY less accurate, kills in fewer hits on short range, and competes with the Peacekeeper on medium range -- dealing the same damage as Peacekeeper with similar accuracy and similar range.

I think somebody's brains farted with this gun, believing it had long range for an SMG.

Well, let's run a comparison:

Peacekeeper: 3 hit kills: Never ............... 4 hit kills up to 35.5 meters

PDW-57........: 3 hit kills: Up to 10.5m .... 4 hit kills up to 25.5 meters

Then add in the fact that PDW-57 aims down the sights faster than the Peacekeeper, giving it another advantage over all the Assault Rifles and the Peacekeeper on short range.

PDW-57 outclasses the Peacekeeper by far.

So why not give it 3 hit kill up to 10.5m ... 4 hit kill up to 25.5 meters and just let it retain it's Assault Rifle ADS speed -- while lowering it's rate of fire to balance it out?

It would still be outclassed by the PDW's faster rate of fire, but would not be THAT horribly outclassed.

Keep in mind that ONLY the M27 has as bad time to kill on short range as Peacekeeper:

ONLY the M27 does not outclass the peacekeeper on short range in time to kill.


Assault rifles:

SWAT556: Needs a shorter burst delay

Movement speed is too fast in the game and maps are too small (and hit detection is too off) for it's burst-fire to be as effective as the M16 was in Black Ops 1. And arguably, M16 still was not effective in Black Ops 1, because of the long burst-fire delay.

M8 is not only superior, it completely outclasses the SWAT556.

SWAT556 is not good on short range, not good on medium range, but is decent on long range and against targets behind cover.

But it's only good if you are behind cover as well.

SCAR-H: Needs slightly less random recoil. I mean: They can decrease the randomness, without decreasing the average high recoil.

Doing so makes the weapon better, without making it much easier to use.

It's too inaccurate to hit stuff behind cover even on medium range, and when M8, AN94, Type 25 and even M27 is capable of hitting targets on that range with ease even when only their heads are visible -- the SCAR-H's ability to penetrate cover is already moot, because it needs AT LEAST one more hit to kill through cover, which makes it kill slower than every other assault rifle in the game at absolutely all times when enemies are behind partial cover.

Then add in the fact that you can't hit enemies on longer ranges without firing single shots, while the Type 25, M8 and AN94 full autos targets.

SCAR-H is not good on short range, not good on medium range, not good on long range and is not good against targets behind cover.

SMR: Needs the FAL to get a 4 hit kill range at ~1500 inches or somewhere like that, so that it can compete on long range.

FAL is better than SMR up to 16.5 meters, where SMR starts to kill faster than FAL up to 38 meters, where FAL kills faster than SMR again.

That means that FAL is better than SMR on short range, and on long range.

FAL is also better than SMR versus targets behind cover on medium range, which makes SMR a niche weapon for medium range versus targets in the open.

FAL will always be used for it's extremely low recoil and respectable time to kill: It can be fired at 550 RPM as a 3 hit kill weapon with deadly accuracy, with relative ease, and every shot fired at that pace will hit dead center on any range.

FAL will still outclass the SMR on long range if it 4 hit kills on 40 meters, because it can fire 4 shots accurately before SMR can fire 3 shots accurately. Accuracy being the key word here, not rate of fire.

M27: Needs to have SMG ADS speed, and/or to have a much longer 4 hit kill range. The existence of Type 25 and M8 makes this weapon completely outclassed: They are both practically just as accurate, but both kill considerably much faster on all ranges but a tiny window of 2.5 meters.

When MTAR also exists, killing much faster on short range, with good enough accuracy to compete on medium range -- the outclassing is complete.


Sniper rifles:

SVU-AS: It's a compact sniper rifle. So why isn't it?

The advantage of a compact sniper rifle is the ability to quickly take down a shot long range and move on.

It should ADS faster than Ballista.

It has low recoil, and that's nice -- but... all it has become is a noob's sniper rifle where you HAVE TO aim down the sights at all times and then fire 5-6 shots down range against an enemy, because even the PDW-57 and Vector pose a threat on 30 meters range.

When you meet SMG users on long range, they have the time to spray you down before you're able to aim down the sights and fire 2 rounds down the range.

In fact, with perfect aim and aiming on the chest, it takes a minimum of 0.60 seconds to kill with the SVU-AS if not already aiming down the sights.

Miss once, on your second shot, and it's 0.80 seconds.

That's the worst in the game.

The XPR.50 KILLS unless you kill them before they've aimed down the sights: The first shot kills.

The SVU-AS kills almost 0.20 seconds after it's user has aimed down the sights, because it needs two hits to kill.

Oh. And make it kill with one headshot silenced. It's just absurdly underpowered silenced compared to the XPR.50.

Add a bit sway to balance out out again, which is another trait associated with a compact sniper: difficulty of aiming accurately.

I'd rather have the SVU-AS bridge AR and Sniper than have it be the sniper rifle that only is used by snipers below level 4.

Ballista: It sways too much.

Keep the sway amount, but slow the sway SPEED down.

It's just tragic to see quickscopers use the DSR.50.



Grip: 1 more percent would not break it.

Most weapons don't receive

Quickdraw handle: A -0.05 seconds flat bonus instead of it's current percentage bonus would still make it the best non-silencer attachment in the game: Killing faster is killing faster. Whether it is because of increased damage or decreased ADS time.

MMS and Target Finder: Should add sway. Why would anyone use red dot over MMS? Target Finder has reduced vision, but that does not matter to it's target group:

Chronic campers.



Footsteps: Where did they go?

Seriously. Black Ops 2 is like MW2 played with the sound turned lower than my comfort level.

I cannot count the times an enemy has snuck up from behind while I'm actually listening for opponent movement while crouch-walking towards an objective with my turtle-beach headset.

And bam. Stabbed in the back. By someone not using Dead Silence.


The GOOD and RIGHT thing to do to counter soundwhoring is NOT to deny everyone the sound of footsteps.

It would be giving everyone the advantage of being able to hear footsteps.

People on regular TV's should be able to hear normal footsteps, without awareness.

Awarness should increase the RANGE of footsteps -- and marginally increase the volume.

Dead Silence should DECREASE the range others hear your footsteps -- and marginally decrease the volume.

Those changes causes both perks to become useful, AND adds back the "sound"  dimension to the game, which Black Ops 2 is sorely lacking right now.

Flinch: The flinch is horribly unbalanced right now.

Snipers can't be flinched. Most weapons cannot hit if you are flinched. Toughness makes all your shots hit even if you flinch.

Nerf toughness, reduce flinch amount AND increase flinch suffered when wielding a non-ACOG sniper so that shooting while flinched doesn't return a hit in most cases.

Movement speed, ESPECIALLY strafe speed, is way too high.

Shooting running enemies often results in misses because of desynchronization.

OFTEN being the key word here.

EMP grenades: Reduce the range.

Likes: 255
Posts: 2920
Registered: ‎17-06-2011

peacekeeper is a smg + ar hybrid

I have no problems hearing footsteps normally. When I run with dead silence + awareness, it feels like I'm cheating.

Turtle Beach's are probably the worst headset on the market.

"Awarness should increase the RANGE of footsteps -- and marginally increase the volume."

This is exactly what it does.

Likes: 183
Posts: 1021
Registered: ‎03-12-2012


It is a hybrid between M27 and PDW.

Except it's much worse than both and any one of them;

As useless as M27 on short range, and as useless as PDW57 on long range.

Every assault rifle in the game is better on short range.

Every SMG in the game is better on short range.

Every assault rifle in the game is better on medium range.

PDW57, Chicom and Skorpion EVO are better on medium range.

Every assault rifle in the game is better on long range.

PDW, Chicom and Skorpion EVO compete with the Peackeeper on long range -- where you need 5 or 6 hits to kill and should not even bother unless your opponent is AFC.


725 RPM

50 round magazine

0.20 seconds to aim down sights / 0.10 with quickdraw

3 hit kills: Up to 10.5 meters

4 hit kills: Up to 25.5 meters

5 hit kills: Up to 34 meters

6 hit kills: Over 63 meters

Medium recoil


725 RPM

30 round magazine

0.25 seconds to aim down sights / 0.15 with Quickdraw

3 hit kills: Never

4 hit kills: Up to 40 meters

5 hit kills: Over 40 meters

Low recoil


725 RPM

32 round magazine

0.25 seconds to aim down the sights

3 hit kills: Never

4 hit kills: Up to 35.5 meters

5 hit kills: Up to 63 meters

6 hit kills: Over 63 meters

Medium ro medium-low recoil[/spoiler]

Likes: 255
Posts: 2920
Registered: ‎17-06-2011

But you fail to see where the PK is better than the m27. The PK gets the smg mobility compared to the m27 having the ar mobility. So though the may be near the same in shots to kill that is not the important factor for why to choose or use the PK.

the PK is like the FAD from MW3. In the right hands it is very powerful and effective weapon in core. In hc it is a beast in anyones hands if they can even even the slightest.

The PK has some of longer range benefits of a AR while keeping the SMG's mobility.

trialstardragon Level 70
Likes: 1954
Posts: 12882
Registered: ‎26-05-2011

Jesus dude, you took that much time regarding a video game weapon feedback? You must really get into this game

Likes: 848
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Registered: ‎07-12-2011

I think ALL of the assault rifles are crap now.    Yeah, the assault rifles are balanced, but its all balanced crap.    LMG's is where its at now.   Great replacement for the assault rifles.   You do NOT need a forward grip on LMG's like you needed in past COD's.   MK48 is VERY powerful with VERY managable recoil at long range.  They are a little slower but you can put a quick grip on it and a stock to speed things up pretty comfortably.   Only negative is Red Dot is a MUST and reloading is a chore.   But with reloading, ya got 100 rounds to play with so after you just annihilated their team and are down to 25 rounds of ammo left, use those 25 rounds to make your way to a nice safe corner to reload in.

Likes: 10
Posts: 95
Registered: ‎12-03-2012

SMGs are fine the way they are now.  The PDW is horrible at long range since the nerfs as the recoil gets really hard to manage.  The accuracy of the Peacekeeper makes it much better than the PDW at long range.

Totally agree with the Scar.  It's very random although i know some people really like it.

SVU is really only used to unlock the diamond camo for snipers.  It is the beginner level rifle but in my experience was the hardest one to complete the challenges.

There is something wrong with movement and the lightweight perk in this game.  It seems to give people Matrix like bullet doging abilities.

Likes: 107
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Registered: ‎30-10-2012

However, Vector, Chicom and Skorpion EVO still compete -- and all of them beat it for short range too.

Likes: 255
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Registered: ‎17-06-2011

the pk is not really meant for short range game play, it is meant for medium range game play.

trialstardragon Level 70
Likes: 1954
Posts: 12882
Registered: ‎26-05-2011

Where every single AR beats it, and the Vector, Chicom and Skorpion EVO compete -- even though they completely blast it on short range, because it has AR ADS speed and lower damage.

Likes: 255
Posts: 2920
Registered: ‎17-06-2011