29 Replies Latest reply: Aug 26, 2013 3:25 PM by spanky'smonkey RSS

Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping

spanky'smonkey

So I got diamond primaries sans the gold assualt and I got real bored. So I strapped on the Ballista and started quick scoping. I learned to two things real fast. 1) There is no aim assist of any kind when you are quick scoping. If your aim is off you miss plain and simple. 2) Landing a well placed shoot while playing aggressive with a sniper is the most gratifying thing in the game, period. To all those Quick Scopers I've dissed over the years I sincerely apologize. This is my first time playing in this manner and I realize I've missed out on a lot of fun. There's a real steep learning curve involved that will improve your gun skills all around once you catch on. Learning to quick scope has improved my performance with the Executioner my favorite go-to pistol for up close in your face fire fights.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    gdexter

    How has qwikscopezzzzing improved your pistol gameplay?

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      spanky'smonkey

      gotta plant your shoots wisely and accurately with the executioner, you learn to keep your kill lanes centered where your target has no choice but to take that OHK pistol to the face.

      • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
        phxs72

        I actually can't disagree that QSing does force better accuracy.  This is different of course from drag scoping but pure QSing, if you are good at it does require being on target.  Prelining up the shot is helpful for all weapons but you will especially notice the benefits on semi's like the pistols.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    bkblazer

    I don't cosider myself a good quickscoper but can hold my own with a sniper by sniping quickly. Just like most aspects of this game, when there is a load out that usually enrages you, the rage goes away fairly quickly when you use it yourself. A little more respect for that gamestyle may surface. Thats a good thing.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    starbuckfrack

    I tried quickscoping and it was a lot of fun. But I have no coordination and I still am pretty good. Well good compared to the kids that do it

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    PutLeCatDown

    I got my first and only nuclear in a free for all match the first time I started quickscoping.... LOL.Pretty sweet huh?

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    Tick7

    I don't have a problem with people that snipe.

     

    I don't hae a problem with people that snipe well, or that quick scope really well. It most definitely is a skill.

     

    However, in general, I have a problem with quick scoping being in the game, because I feel as though it completely eliminates the sort of gun balance any FPS game needs.

     

    Shotguns and SMGs = great up close, crap at range.

     

    Asssault Rifles = great at medium ranges, competent at short & long ranges.

     

    Light Machine Guns = great at long ranges, crap at short range.

     

    Sniper rifles (in theory) = great at long range, crap at short range.

     

    Sniper rifles (in Call of Duty) = great at long range, great at short range.

     

    When you look at other multiplayer FPSs, and look at the mechanics being their sniping game play, none of those games have any sort of modifiers that allow snipers to be hugely effective at short range. BF3 quite literally punishes you for taking a sniper rifle into a close combat scenario. Successful sniping, whether it be Halo, or BF, etc., rewards players that are able to pick and choose their gunfights to their liking - namely, the players that know how to keep their targets at a distance and give their weapon a great chance to succeed.

     

    Call of Duty should really have done that as well. Gun balance is completely thrown out the window when you allow a long range weapon to perform so well at short ranges, via a skill that isn't all that difficult to pick up, as the OP has suggested

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      trialstardragon

      I completely agree with your view.

       

      But sadly the devs try to cater to all player styles of gaming in this game.. something done to get more sales at the cost of making some players unhappy. Which is ok for them since they are a company first and money is the biggest priority.

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      srey89

      i agree with you aspecially about the shotguns but the one thing that i hate is that the KSG can hit you from a mile away and kill you. there are so many times that i play in core or hardcore and either one i get hit once from a long distance and i am dead. i think they need to cut back on the range a little for that gun. its a little rediculous.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    Bielsalmighty

    Quickscoping is not easy, that is definitely true. However, like anything, it can be learned and people can become proficient at it. Once people are proficient, THATS when it starts to become overpowering. Having a gun which can lay an OHK smackdown at any range is OP in core, however you look at it. The shotguns have an OHK ability, but that is limited by range. The KSG has reach but requires a headshot as you move to medium distance engagements, which more or less balances that out too.

     

    It doesn't bother me overly in HC, but in Core it can be horrible to have your weapon choice rendered entirely irrelevant. QSers need to bear this in mind. Sure its fun to do, but its not fun to be on the end of when done well, no matter how much ability and practise it took to get it down...

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      deamonomic

      Bielsalmighty wrote:

       

      Quickscoping is not easy, that is definitely true. However, like anything, it can be learned and people can become proficient at it. Once people are proficient, THATS when it starts to become overpowering. Having a gun which can lay an OHK smackdown at any range is OP in core, however you look at it. The shotguns have an OHK ability, but that is limited by range. The KSG has reach but requires a headshot as you move to medium distance engagements, which more or less balances that out too.

       

      It doesn't bother me overly in HC, but in Core it can be horrible to have your weapon choice rendered entirely irrelevant. QSers need to bear this in mind. Sure its fun to do, but its not fun to be on the end of when done well, no matter how much ability and practise it took to get it down...

      I can kill you at any range with my pistol or my SMG or my AR. its about using the weapon properly for the range your at. Its not op. Its actually harder to land a shot up close then far away. A proficient player with the KSG will still wreck with it as will anyone proficient in any weapon. In the right hands every weapon is overpowered.

      • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
        Bielsalmighty

        I agree up to a point. However having a weapon meant for certain ranges start outperforming other weapons within THEIR supposed area of dominance is where balance begins to suffer.

         

        Its a case of fun V balance, and thats a difficult line to walk. Whichever way you do it, some people will be upset.

        • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
          riksterinto

          The point deamonic was trying to make is that snipers don't outperform other weapons in their area of dominance.  Yes a really good sniper in this game can outplay other players using any of the other classes but this is no different form the guys with SMGs, LMGs and ARs who I see go 100-3 in this game fairly easily. It's not that often that you see snipers get these types of games.

           

          If you take a look at the stats of the people who are that good with a sniper rifles you will see most of them have a higher KD with the other weapon classes so be happy they are sniping because they would be owning you even more if they weren't.

           

          I think it's more of a problem with everyone's perception after getting killed by a OHK weapon.  It seems cheap and unbeatable but really it isn't and there are lots of strategies that can be used to overcome the OHK weapons once you learn all of the weapon strengths and weaknesses.

          • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
            Bielsalmighty

            So if someone becomes equally proficient at landing shots in CQB and at long to extreme range with an OHK weapon in Core, thats balanced?

             

            The point isn't necessarily that they DO its that they CAN. And its someone achieves the latter, balance is upset.

            • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
              deamonomic

              Bielsalmighty wrote:

               

              So if someone becomes equally proficient at landing shots in CQB and at long to extreme range with an OHK weapon in Core, thats balanced?

               

              The point isn't necessarily that they DO its that they CAN. And its someone achieves the latter, balance is upset.

              If i become proficient with killing people with my shoe at any range.... Honestly thats what this argument sounds like to me (no offense intended). OHK is what everyone seems to focus on, which is rather foolish in my opinion. But less so then the realism argument at any rate.

               

              Becoming proficient at it is not something the majority can hope to achieve. It doesnt out preform other weapons. The other weapons preform amazing at any range IF YOU ARE PROFICIENT. Basically your argument is that if the guy is skilled this weapon is deadly in their hands. Thing is any weapon in the game is deadly as hell in a skilled players hands. I got sniped repeatedly one game by a bloody crossbow. This guy knew his stuff with it. He managed to hit me dam near every time.

               

              My question is, if you can land your shot WHY shouldnt you be given a kill? if you get OHK from 500 feet away or 2 feet you still got OHK because the managed to land their shot.

              • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
                Bielsalmighty

                OHK is a big deal in Core, very big. Thats why Shotguns have such extreme limitations, and why snipers arguably do too. Thing is, Shotguns have a physical limitation and as such there is no workaround. Snipers aren't physically limited and as such people have figured out a workaround. My argument is what is the point of having weapons specialising at certain ranges, if there is an OHK machine that can compete at any range?

                 

                Btw I do apologise if I sound salty or bullish. I'm quite enjoying this debate. I have to say in Blops 1 if I ran into a QSer who smashed me for a whole game, I had to hold my hands up and admit to being pwnt. Other games, I dont think it was totally out of hand either, even though at times it seemed like every man and his dog was a QSer or QS wannabe. My concern is that it doesn't become TOO easy to do. I dont think its too 'easy' to do in this game, but I wouldn't like to see it become any easier to do.

            • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
              riksterinto

              I believe this is just an issue with perception.  The reality in this game is that pretty much every other weapon has a time to kill that is less than .4 seconds which is the amount of time it takes a sniper to ADS.  If used proficiently, a skilled player should have no problem taking out a sniper at close range.  If a sniper takes out a shot gunner, SMG, etc at short range it's likely because the sniper knew they were coming, pure dumb luck or the other player just didn't approach the situation properly. 

              I play with snipers myself sometimes and when I get short range kills on these other classes it's always because I know they are coming for me. Also, I've notcie lots of the rushers don't have dexterirty or quick draw yet run around corners like fools thinking they can defeat everything at short range.

              • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
                Bielsalmighty

                If a shotgunner was aware of someone at extreme distance, theres sod all they can do about it. Thats how the other side of the OHK family has its equilibrium established.

                 

                Snipers have relatively slow scope-in, ridiculous hipfire and idle sway sure, but that doesn't stop the gun from being able to consistently compete in ranges it has no right to.

                 

                As I said to Deamonomic, I dont think QS is out of hand, but I think it has the potential to be. Even a CoD dev has conceded that.

      • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
        teflon_skull

        deamonomic wrote:

         

        Bielsalmighty wrote:

         

        Quickscoping is not easy, that is definitely true. However, like anything, it can be learned and people can become proficient at it. Once people are proficient, THATS when it starts to become overpowering. Having a gun which can lay an OHK smackdown at any range is OP in core, however you look at it. The shotguns have an OHK ability, but that is limited by range. The KSG has reach but requires a headshot as you move to medium distance engagements, which more or less balances that out too.

         

        It doesn't bother me overly in HC, but in Core it can be horrible to have your weapon choice rendered entirely irrelevant. QSers need to bear this in mind. Sure its fun to do, but its not fun to be on the end of when done well, no matter how much ability and practise it took to get it down...

        I can kill you at any range with my pistol or my SMG or my AR. its about using the weapon properly for the range your at. Its not op. Its actually harder to land a shot up close then far away. A proficient player with the KSG will still wreck with it as will anyone proficient in any weapon. In the right hands every weapon is overpowered.

        You completely missed a major part of what they said.  One hit kill.  That is where the issue lies.  Throw in bullet/death overwrite, whether intentional or lag, and you have people firing first, landing shots, and still dying while the sniper continues on.

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      furrymatt

      lmfao qs is not easy are you kidding me?
      how is it not easy and Everyone says there is no auto aim that is a lie when you aim with a sniper and you are on someone it will drag your sight towards the direction they are running quickscoping you have to be scoped up for half a second but in final killcams and stuff its delayed making it look like you black scope someone when you reall didnt

      • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
        deamonomic

        furrymatt wrote:

         

        lmfao qs is not easy are you kidding me?
        how is it not easy and Everyone says there is no auto aim that is a lie when you aim with a sniper and you are on someone it will drag your sight towards the direction they are running quickscoping you have to be scoped up for half a second but in final killcams and stuff its delayed making it look like you black scope someone when you reall didnt

        If they are getting use of the aim assist its not a traditional QS and ontop of that IF they are they have to wait a bit longer before pulling the trigger giving you more time to kill them. as riksterinto said above The kill times for most weapons is around the amount of time it takes a Sniper to ADS at all. At that point its who is more accurate. You get aim assist ALOT earlier then the sniper does and from farther off while NOT aiming down the sight. You have the advantage over the QS if you are good enough to us it.

      • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
        Bielsalmighty

        Put your money where your mouth is. Lets see a gameplay or two of you running around, bona fide QSing. I have a PVR and am happy to cap for you. Feel free to PM me GT and which theatre video I'll be looking for.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    FatalArrow

    Quickscoping being difficult doesn't mean it isn't a gameplay balance issue.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    electricfuneralfire

    OP do me a favor and dont be one of those teammates who QS or die. Play aggressively as a sniper by all means. But be a sniper and dont screw your teammates over by trying to purely QS.

     

    Other than that I just want to lol. Anyone you see on here who complains that QSing or Snipers are overpowered hasnt tried out a sniper rifle in multiplayer bottom line. Hardest class/play style to adapt to.

     

    The bad thing about it is people try to hard with it. The get frustrated and focus on just kills/KD and when they dont succeedd they focus more on kills and KD. Then they start F'ing there team over because they arent focused on anything else.

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    frtthunderpants

    I disagree with you the most gratifying kill you can get in this game is with a crossbow at range dropping behind cover and not seeing it land but getting that hit marker in your peripheral vision and knowing move and get the next kill is so gratifying

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    teflon_skull

    I think the least talked about reason people hate quick scopers is bullet overwrite.  It 'seemingly' happens with every gun, but it's more noticeable with snipers and shotguns.

     

    Example:

     

    You have a scorpion and round a corner.  You see the enemy before they see you.  You fire off 3-5 rounds to the upper chest area.(Hardcore)  You can see your shots are on target as you flinch and drop to the floor.  They keep running.  Did your bullets just stop going to target after their single shot killed you?  What happened?

     

    Discussion/Theory:

     

    Some will say lag.  Some will say sync.  Two things this game handles very poorly.  Did you even shoot to the game/on their screen.  Or, did your dying nullify your shots even though they were already in flight and should have resulted in you both dying if they actually got their shot off before your bullets landed.

     

    I have a theory.  Hang on tight.  Quick Scopers do not have a front iron sight on their rifles.  Instead, they have used dark magic mixed with voodoo to mount a miniture of Keanu Reeves on the end of their rifle.  When the quick scoper fires, the miniture says 'uwoah' and your bullets just stall and fall to the floor.  I say burn them.  Burn them at the stake.  And...get a priest, a live chicken, and Tom Cruise to help remove the voodoo off their rifles.

     

    Yeah, that was stupid.  So is this game.  Every time someone runs through a door and it opens after, bullets fly around corners, people shoot through everything when head glitching but cardboard boxes and barrels, you die in one non-headshot from a gun incapable of such, and someone shoots you while looking and running in another direction because they are using a xim/scuff/mod, I want to [edit]put a dev in corner timeout in front of the rest of the group[/edit] for not at least attempting to fix anything other than a few glitch spots and some gun balancing.  Multiplayer is a mess.

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      SWlTCHl3LADE

      Thanks spanky\'smonkey for giving an honest opinion. Sure do wish others would agree and understand that it's something which takes practice with a reward at the end instead of raging (or better yet, thinking they can't do it). You know how the saying goes....can't never could!

       

      Anyways, Treyarch should understand this side of competitive gaming and move their support efforts towards the gaming lobbies. There is so much lag and non-balanced play on their servers, it's not even funny. Totally ruining the game!

  • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
    Adam1234567893

    Um there is aim assist if you quickscope there's just no aim assist if you block shot. Quicscoping isn't bad or an exploit aim assist the only thing I hate.

    • Re: Oh So Wrong about Quick Scoping
      spanky'smonkey

      what exactly are you calling aim assist? if you quick scope then you understand there is no magic "I was close enough so they gave me the hit anyway!" aim assist. If your aim is off when you see that first frame in the sights then you need to either drag scope or take the shoot and miss. more often then not you'll miss.